Lies And Statistics
Here’s another contribution from guest poster Steven Wagenheim.
In today’s post he’s trying to unveil some of the outrageous claims that you often see on the Net, especially in the ‘make money’ business. It may put your mind at rest concerning this topic.
Here goes. Enjoy!
Lies…Damn Lies…And Statistics
Hype makes the world go round. Well, at the very least, it makes the Internet marketing world go round. You don’t have to travel far to see it in print. It’s rampant in articles, ads, sales copy, blog posts…just about any place where the written word can be found. Each product is better than the one before it. Well, it’s time to put an end to some of these lies, half truths and everything else that makes Internet marketing a dirty phrase that many people look to avoid like the plague.
If you’re looking for the biggest lies of all, take your pick. How about earnings? We constantly hear about all the money that these marketers make but how much of it do they really keep? What many people don’t realize is that when somebody says that they made $60,000 from their Adwords campaign, what they don’t tell you is that their expenses for that campaign were $55,000. When you take their net profit, it’s not really all that much money, is it. That’s why stats can be so misleading. Any stat can be displayed in a way where it looks better than what it really is.
Then there’s conversion percentage. This is a really gray area. Lots of conversion stats are plain made up. I’m not going to point any fingers but I know people who just come up with stats out of their head, figuring that nobody’s going to notice the difference anyway. Why? Because quite honestly, few people have a clue about what good conversion stats are simply because they don’t track those stats themselves. Well, I do. I’ve been tracking my stats for over 5 years and I can tell you this much…I don’t see how anybody gets 10% to 20% conversion. I’m happy with my 2% to 4% that I get on a regular basis. And yes, it does fluctuate that much.
Then of course there are the people who just flat out fabricate stats with great graphical programs like Photoshop. Doctoring of screen prints is a big thing. You really can’t trust them. So what I suggest to people, if they really want to convince somebody of their income is to create a video of their earnings. Videos are very difficult to fake and they’re a lot more impressive.
Bottom line is this. You have to be very careful about what you see and hear online. Marketers will always try to put their best foot forward, and that’s understandable. So you have to be able to discern the difference between slight exaggeration and outright lies.
It isn’t easy.
To YOUR Success,
Steven Wagenheim
Blowing The Lid Off The Lies Of The Internet
Tags: statistics, stats
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August 19th, 2008 at 3:54 pm
The funny thing about this is that internet marketing just reflects real-life marketing. No matter what kind of product or sales pitch you are dealing with, you have to look at the motivation of the person doing the talking; if they make money when you buy something, their pitch is certainly not unbiased, and may very well be deceitful.
Not to say all commission salespeople are dishonest - you just have to be aware of that element when deciding if something is a good deal for you. The sales pitch is just one component of a successful purchase.
Thanks for the good info.
August 19th, 2008 at 4:50 pm
Wow, how I wish this post will just pop up each time clicks on a page with some of those claims that make you wonder in utter disbelief because of the outrageous claims that we are bombarded with.
I have always believed that true success does not come that easy, one has to work hard, focus and be persistent. Of course this costs me traffic in the short run but as reflected on this post it sure pays in the long run
August 20th, 2008 at 1:55 am
I think in the beginning, conversions and profits are really small. As I am working in this field, I know that big profit requires a lot of work, good strategy and professional employees. One person could implement a PPC campaign with 1% conversion, other can increase the same campaign at 5%. It depends a lot of experience, work and money involved. You have to invest money to get money.
Another ex in SEO - there are a lot of SEO experts on net who get results; but how long do they work on sites? No one gets no 1 in Google at a competition of 80 millions sites, except if they work long time on a site - their client will pay good money for that result.
It’s true what are you talking about lies.
Gabi Andrei
August 20th, 2008 at 11:04 am
Steven Wagenheim,i like your way of writing.really smart.you discussed it so easily.thanks for that.waiting for your next post like this.
August 20th, 2008 at 11:24 am
I know exactly what you have written. I am new to this industry and I am confronted with a smorgasbord of truths and lies…of which I do not really know how to tell…
August 20th, 2008 at 3:05 pm
All true, I remember when I fist started online, there was so much BS, I’m glad I was too broke to fall for any of it.
Thanks Steven,
JR
August 21st, 2008 at 5:05 am
To be honest I made some money in the past. Not big money, but some. But day by day is more difficult. Things has changed, rules are much more complicate, there are too many competitors around. Sometime I think that making money online is a question of chance and option. In fact you need a big chance to make a good option.
Valerian Dantes
August 21st, 2008 at 5:33 am
It was only today that I saw a “conversion” rate of “80%.” There just seems to be more of these fabrications in internet marketing.
Dave
August 21st, 2008 at 3:54 pm
The old saying goes buyer beware.Do your homework and try to get a recommendation or two if possible.
Jerry
August 22nd, 2008 at 2:48 pm
the post makes a great point there. usually, when someone claims that he made a certain amount of money online, i don’t even stop to think about the expenses he incurred to make that much cash. it isn’t outright lying perhaps, but it’s quite a large fudging of the truth.
August 23rd, 2008 at 11:25 am
I agree that stats are very easy to fake. (I used to do it for a few laughs). Anyway, I don’t think that your example was really that, persuasive. I would say that a $5,000 net is fairly good.
August 23rd, 2008 at 11:27 am
Well, yea that is true. People sometimes put to much faith in stats, and pictures. I think if they would look at the information given and think logical then they would not be stuck buying a product from a lier.
August 23rd, 2008 at 12:50 pm
Gain your basic knowledge before approaching these so called guaranteed money making campaign or course. There are always the BAD guys in every trade whom will do anything just to make sure that make a conversion out of you. Be real careful.
August 23rd, 2008 at 1:51 pm
Hi,
Just a some commnets on the contense of the post.
Firstly, I can’t really understand how trading standards (in the uk) don’t get involved with blatant miss representation. If most of the claims which are eluded to in the post (of which i agree with) are so outrages, then surly there is a call for a regulatory body get involved here.
Secondly. I also surprised that there isn’t some sort of auditor or endorser type setup available who verify the claims made. I’m thinking here of something along the lines of Blue square I used to see year ago that basically allowed websites to display a button / banner to show that they had been some how verified. This would root out the cowboys surly (esp if you charged a £25/$50 annual subscription )… just given someone there next million dollar business.
PS. The pop up reminder and math things is really annoying.
August 23rd, 2008 at 8:46 pm
In the Internet marketing industry, there are likes of Enron and Worldcom. It’s like in a basket, there are good eggs and bad eggs. We need to exercise our utmost discern in weighing things whether claims are true. If it’s too good to be true, then run away.
August 24th, 2008 at 9:02 am
This is a poison that goes further and deeper across the globe, riding on the insidious personal assumption or belief that its “okay to lie”, indeed I’d go further and state it as “you won’t be successful if you don’t lie”. Its accepted and expected from our politicians and leaders, its accepted and expected from our media, its accepted and expected from our work colleagues and competitors, and I would say its started to become debatable whether its accepted and expected from our friends and family. God forbid.
August 24th, 2008 at 10:26 am
On forums especially, I see a lot of fakers (bloody scammers) They do nothing but make some newbies feel inferior. I love bashing them.
~Sahil
August 24th, 2008 at 10:42 am
Thanks a lot for your real informative post.i like your way of writing.cool.you know the demand of your reader.Thanks for your suggestion and keep it up with this type of many post.
August 24th, 2008 at 5:06 pm
there are a lot of SEO experts on net who get results; but how long do they work on sites? No one gets no 1 in Google at a competition of 80 millions sites, except if they work long time on a site - their client will pay good money for that result.
It’s true what are you talking about lies.
August 25th, 2008 at 9:57 am
I think it is important to be a critical thinker. You can never count on other people’s opinions. It is valuable to do research and find the truth out for yourself.
August 25th, 2008 at 11:07 am
All true, I remember when I fist started online, there was so much BS, I’m glad I was too broke to fall for any of it.
Thanks Steven,
August 25th, 2008 at 12:27 pm
Thanks for the great post,I remember when I started my business online how my email was bombarded with sales pitches, and I still get a lot of them.
What people need to remember is the saying that if something sounds to good to be true it usually isn’t true and always remember that the person making the outrageous sales pitch is only trying to make money for themselves.
It’s a great post,and I hope more people see it.
Thanks,
Martha
August 25th, 2008 at 7:12 pm
I despise most internet marketing; there really are so many lies and scams out there it makes it difficult for anyone to trust honest marketing messages.
Barry Wise
August 26th, 2008 at 9:06 am
You are right. Statistics can be manipulated to support liars’ claims. They can also provide a wealth of descriptive and predictive data that can drastically improve your business. It depends on how you use it.
Statistics are like science. You can use then for good or for bad. It all depends on the person.
Throughout my life I’ve learned that no matter how good something is, an unscrupulous person can find a way to misuse it.
Warmly,
Linda P. Morton
August 26th, 2008 at 12:57 pm
We will definitely do a check before engaging a SEO / SEM company. Statistics are used in the support of a sales talk in the business world and it is quite common that data is often manipulated.
August 26th, 2008 at 2:22 pm
you left off one other probably cause for such huge checks. MULTIPLE sites. I have talked to a supposed ‘guru’ or two and they tend to have 100s of sites. literally 100s. with each pulling 1-2 dollars a day it is entirely plausible to net 5 figure checks every month without buying traffic.
August 27th, 2008 at 1:15 am
It’s only statistics that are lies but I think there are a lot of sites that post fake testimonials…what’s worse is that some of them even read like fakes, they dont even sound genuine!
Sameer Panjwani
August 28th, 2008 at 9:16 am
Great example of the reality of statistics. For the whole story, it’s always a matter of what you show and tell.
August 29th, 2008 at 2:18 am
Stats can be very misleading and manipulated to suit any sales pitch, though it is possible to have a higher percentage of conversions it is a lot of work. Suppose you had site A, that sold cups and saucers, had the standard contact, home and about us and 2 optimised pages, one for selling china cups and one for saucers. If you target each page to 1 or 2 (popular/wordtracker) keywords then the traffic you get, will be specific and generate a higher conversion rate. Site B with 300 product pages would bring in much more traffic, as it potentially has 300 more landing pages which will each get picked up for a multitude of keywords. If they are both equally optimised in terms of incoming links site B will bring in much more traffic to the site and likely generate more revenue, but the conversion rate will be much lower than site A. This is because the multitude of keywords it’s being picked up for over its 300 pages. Some of which will be relevant and many that won’t.(If you have a large site just look at your stats and to see some of the bizzar keywords that your site will get picked up for, each of which will contribute to lower your conversion rate (the + side of the extra pages is your site should also get picked up for a larger pool of relevant keywords)).
Khaled
September 3rd, 2008 at 9:39 am
Want to know how I avoid the hype? Particularly for big-ticket items. I don’t purchase anything from anybody….if I made more money than them the prior year.
You should hear the silence on the other end of the phone when you ask to see their returns.
Tom
September 7th, 2008 at 12:44 am
I agree that is is easy to present misleading statistics to make almost any argument. However at least when people are using statistics to make a point I much prefer that over their limited experience. Statistics can at least be a jumping off point for a discussion and for me personally I’d rather here number or figures than someone’s opinion. I don’t put much stock in opinions, numbers and figures have a hard time lying even though they can be bent to your will.
September 24th, 2008 at 8:09 pm
Nowadays, a lot of online marketing would tell you a lot of lies like saying you can earn a certain amount of money but in fact, they are just putting those words to attract people to click they sites but nothing is really there. I sure hope someday we can get rid of all those sites giving false info.
October 15th, 2008 at 12:32 pm
I notice that even now its fairly normal to find advertisements in the papers about people holding “seminars” on how to make money off the internet , usually failing to note costs involved while emphasizing on the raw money made.
Stats will always be finetuned to support an arguement, or exaggerated in some way. Just part of marketing i guess.
November 5th, 2008 at 10:13 pm
I agree that it is very misleading when people just highlight the gross income, leaving out the many expenses.
I stated almost day one on my blog that all of the income will be put back into building my domain portfolio. So, I still haven’t cashed out a red cent ( started blogging 4 months ago ). I have been making a little here and there, but I just reinvest it.
Ben